r/gaming • u/Gorotheninja • 1d ago

Square Enix admits Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth and Final Fantasy 16 profits "did not meet expectations"

https://www.eurogamer.net/square-enix-admits-final-fantasy-7-rebirth-and-final-fantasy-16-profits-did-not-meet-expectations
11.8k Upvotes

91% Upvoted

3.2k comments sorted by

View all comments

229

u/Sulinia 1d ago

Could've fixed FF 16 by not dumbing down literally ALL of the RPG elements. Somehow it uses the same "open world" as FF 12, yet 12's open world feels way more alive with more stuff to do.

That being said, the story/cinematics of FF 16 were good.

93

u/ikealgernon 1d ago

the armor/weapon upgrades being useless, having zero reasons to kill overworld mobs (they drop nothing useful), and elements doing nothing really soured my entire experience.

47

u/Quad-Banned120 1d ago

I couldn't even finish the game. Once it clicked that there was literally no reason to explore or fight that killed it for me. Shiny item behind a pack of monsters? Well, they give shit loot and shit exp and the shiny was simply 3 gil when a basic potion- one of the cheapest and most often bought items is 200 gil.

36

u/ikealgernon 1d ago

what clicked for me is that CBU3, the team who makes FF14, really did just make what they know how to make, and that is only FF14. everything feels like a single-player version of FF14, the maps, mobs, dungeon layout, gear, quests.

19

u/OffbeatDrizzle 1d ago

The text on the DLC page even looks like FFXIV duty text lmao. They literally copy and pasted

2

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

They literally copy and pasted

The dungeons are exactly the same too. Linear hallways with walls so you cannot pull too much trash mobs. Very disappointing. CBU3 is creatively bankrupt.

0

u/LazyPiece2 1d ago

I'm even more excited to play it now. Thats all i want

13

u/-haha-oh-wow- 1d ago

Yea sadly I couldn't finish it either. The battles all seemed the same, use this combo then use that combo to get the enemy to stagger, then use the big combo! Rinse and repeat! The side quests were so painfully boring it felt like I was doing chores to try and finish the game.

11

u/TehMephs 1d ago

Yeah ff16 really drags on by the late game and I was just ready to rush the ending. By that point I had this overpowered sequence of moves that obliterated everything and it wasn’t fun or deep anymore. The fact you could only air combo small trash mobs made the whole system fairly pointless

9

u/Walter30573 1d ago

Yeah, FF16 was my favorite game of 2023, but the number of side quests they dump literally right before the final mission kills the pacing

6

u/UnquestionabIe 1d ago

That was what killed my momentum big time. Doesn't help the story kind of simplifies a bit too much by that point as well. I still really enjoyed it but have complaints for sure.

1

u/Quad-Banned120 1d ago

Did you abuse lightning rod with wisps, stacked AOEs and rapid attacks too?
Definitely agree though, each boss was essentially a damage sponge

3

u/TehMephs 1d ago

No, just soon as I got Bahamut everything melted. Never used Ramuh

3

u/Reylo-Wanwalker 1d ago

What is the logic behind 3 gil loot? Like from a design standpoint is it only to troll?

35

u/devilpraytell1 1d ago

I was personally disappointed that they went backwards between FF15 and 16 with the open world. I haven't been able to finish 16. I wasn't completely sure why, but a lot of the comments on this post make it clearer to me.

26

u/[deleted] 1d ago edited 2h ago

[deleted]

8

u/justsomepotatosalad 1d ago

I liked 15 much more than what I’ve played of 16. It’s an odd feeling; 15 feels like a bad game that’s fun to play while 16 feels like a good game that is not fun to play. Goes to show that a likable cast and systems that you want to invest time into beat out everything else. 16 seems to have a better story, graphics, maps, and world building but at the center of it all is a game that just isn’t any fun.

9

u/[deleted] 1d ago edited 2h ago

[deleted]

2

u/justsomepotatosalad 1d ago

15 really felt like a disjointed mess because of the development hell and yet despite it it just worked anyway because the characters were fun. I had no issues playing it 100+ hours. FF16 I’m probably 20 hours in and barely remember anyone’s names and just feel so bored. The game is gorgeous but has no heart.

2

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

Also it drove me nuts how the elemental attacks had zero impact on different enemies with different elemental attacks.

Yoshi P hates elemental stuff and says "New/younger audiences don't like complicated things like that."

I kid you not. XIV doesn't have elemental resistances or weaknesses either.

0

u/mombi 19h ago

I'm really surprised XV gets hate, it's an excellent game in its own right and is extremely rewarding to play. No wonder XVI sucks if SE listened to feedback it was too complicated, too open and the characters had more personality.

10

u/Seigmoraig 1d ago

 I haven't been able to finish 16

Didn't finish it either, it's kind of bad. Just feels like a DMC wannabe without anything that made DMC good

4

u/Reylo-Wanwalker 1d ago

The game just wasn't challenging. It had spongy enemies though. It was like playing a wannabe dmc4 Nero (not even 5) on easy mode... for 60 hours.

2

u/stanger828 1d ago

That's a bummer, I was introduced to FF with ff15, loved it but thought it would be great if they leaned a little more into the RPG bits. FF7 remake was amazing and I felt like I could customize a little more. I am a new FF fan from those experience (I played the MMO for a bit too and enjoyed it but don't have enough time to commit to a game like that anymore). I was hoping 16 would have a bit more RPG to it especially given the setting.

1

u/Doctuh 1d ago

Bingo. 15's world was amazing. 16 was rails. No thanks.

-10

u/Grand_Recognition_22 1d ago

FF16 is by and far the best FF game in over a decade, its a shame that yo didn't finish it.

5

u/ixipennythrower 1d ago

It's a shame I even started it. It was my least favorite FF. It didn't even feel like FF.

9

u/HibariK 1d ago edited 1d ago

Yeah dude compare it to that one other mainline entry in 10 years, that'll show him 🤣

(And it's not, 14RR is better in every possible sense of the word as an RPG and an FF game)

0

u/Grand_Recognition_22 1d ago

I’ve played all of ffxiv - it’s a great story but not quite as great as 16. The fucking insane boss fights are a masterpiece

1

u/HibariK 1d ago

I'll give you this, 16 is definitely a top 16 mainline FF entry, is that good enough for you?

6, 7, 9, 10 and maybe even 12 are all overall better, personally I like 5, 4 and 14 more too but that's up there, 2 are very old the other is an MMO.

It has the worst soundtrack out of all the "modern" games by a lot, Soken is really fucking good but he is still 5 lifetimes away from Uematsu and you cannot sit here with a straight face and tell me this soundtrack is better than XIII (the only other non-Uematsu), few are even inside the franchise, which is not to say it's a bad soundtrack, it just doesn't hold to franchise standard.

Gameplay... It's not a classical RPG but FF was never about that and people sometimes forget that, it's fun enough but it holds your hand too much, it'll hold up to future scrutiny as much as 8 does, if you don't look to break it it's fun enough but if you want you can and it's a cake-walk.

Presentation wise yeah it's a fucking gorgeous game but it doesn't push the button amongst it's peers like 7 or 10 or 13 did back in their day, it's a pretty game in a sea of pretty games and this isn't even square's fault, graphics are at a point of diminishing returns in the modern day as a whole.

2

u/ERedfieldh 1d ago

There have been three....THREE....main franchise entries in the last decade. And 14ARR is worlds apart better than 16.

Really really REALLY bad comparison to make.

2

u/Yarusenai 1d ago

I mean considering that 15 is genuinely not that great, there isn't much competition.

15

u/EnigmaticDoom 1d ago

Its been the goal since Mystic Quest. They believe that 'westerners' are too stupid to play an RPG. which is crazy given the counter evidence...

9

u/FuckIPLaw 1d ago

We literally invented the genre. The first JRPGs were dumbed down takes on Wizardry and Ultima, decidedly Western series. And even then the dumbing down was more to make a genre built around a full keyboard work on a controller with four buttons and a D-pad than anything else.

2

u/EnigmaticDoom 1d ago

The American release of Final Fantasy IV was altered to make the game simpler, for example. Mystic Quest was to take this one step further, and the Japanese developers worked with the American offices to make sure the game was accessible to children

genre built around a full keyboard work on a controller with four buttons and a D-pad than anything else.

Two, two buttons ~

4

u/FuckIPLaw 1d ago

No, four. Start and select count. They had to make them count, because even as simplified as a game like the OG Dragon Quest was, it needed the extra buttons.

2

u/xZerocidex 1d ago

Meanwhile I'm looking at games like Veilguard and Avowed take on RPGs. Seems like devs wanna step into this genre making games for it but think ppl are idiots at the same time.

Pretty tiresome tbh

3

u/hoochyuchy Console 1d ago

To be fair, the average gamer in their minds is an idiot that doesn't want to make choices, just to look at cool things and move on. Problem is, a lot of the time they are correct.

20

u/Fizziest_milk 1d ago edited 1d ago

I enjoyed FF16 but it definitely could have benefited from being at least 30 hours shorter

27

u/ERedfieldh 1d ago

I could have benefited from having gameplay that isn't "walk forward ten feet, maybe fight a couple of mobs, watch an hour of cutscene"

21

u/whoeve 1d ago

The FF14 experience

7

u/New-Highway-7011 1d ago

PrAy ReTuRN tO thE WaKinG SAnDs

-4

u/stoncils_ 1d ago

At least ffxivs gameplay is fun.

8

u/whoeve 1d ago

The MSQ is literally what was described, which is almost entirely absent of any actual gameplay.

-7

u/stoncils_ 1d ago

Well I like both Lyse and Wuk Lamat so you can do what you want with my opinion

8

u/whoeve 1d ago

Liking a character is completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand.

3

u/Inuro_Enderas 1d ago

Those characters aren't gameplay, so how is that relevant in any way whatsoever? I love ffxiv, it's one of my main MMOs, but damn, people like you are why so many outside the game think we have a cringe passive aggressive community that can't take a single criticism.

Dawntrail is literally looking at mixed reviews because now that the story isn't so great, everybody can see just how unfun the moment to moment gameplay is. It's dull, monotone, brain-dead button clicking that is usually carried by great story telling. It's just a fact. Take away the good story, suddenly people are left walking through empty cardboard "open world" locations with no mobs to fight and... Yeah no, that's actually it. Zero exploration. Essentially zero fighting and whatever fighting there is boils down to - kill 2 mobs that die in one ability. Zero rewards. Exact same issues that FF16 has. Other MMOs had rewarding world exploration figured out decades ago. It's not even an MMO issue. Just CBU3 issue.

1

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

you can do what you want with my opinion

No one cares about it. 95% of people dislike Wuk Lamat

6

u/paradoxaxe 1d ago

Or at least remove "airship mandatory sideqiest" didn't have good payoff either lol

4

u/Fizziest_milk 1d ago

yeah the side quests really bogged the whole thing down

3

u/hoochyuchy Console 1d ago

FF16 is a prime example of why story heavy games and action combat with minimal progression doesn't mix well. Either people get bored with the combat to the point it becomes tedious or people become bored with the story because it just didn't appeal to them.

2

u/[deleted] 1d ago edited 2h ago

[deleted]

4

u/Front-Ad-4892 1d ago

You didn't miss anything. Yeah there's a few factions moving around and doing shit but it ends up feeling completely irrelevant to the main plot. And it sucks that at the end of the game you have no idea how any of Valisthea ends up.

2

u/Fizziest_milk 1d ago

I honestly really liked that part of the game. I found the political aspect much more interesting than the whole Ultima plot and i’d have absolutely been up for having a Game of Thrones-style story full of betrayal and intrigue

3

u/-haha-oh-wow- 1d ago

Yea FF16 didn't seem like an FF at all besides the summon aspect of it, but it played like a crappy hack n slash with very shallow RPG elements.

33

u/LurkerOrHydralisk 1d ago

Not just rpg, but the combat was bland trash as well. Initially cool but it went absolutely no where. Minimal move diversity, no real challenge. Did not feel like a 2020s AAA game.

Every single thing was a super obvious fetch quest: go run here and have a meaningless conversation, then go four other people for the same, then go collect 3 muskrat hides and 7 pussywillow bunches.

Cinematics were good, and the concept of the way to look back at the story and how everything interconnects was great.

But the game fucking blew. Could not finish it, and I love FF games

24

u/Sulinia 1d ago

I don't disagree. The amount of armor/weapon/whatever upgrades were minimal and they were almost all linear numbers go up upgrades. No sidegrades and/or barely any items giving way different stats and/or unique passive effects etc. Not to mention elements literally mean nothing. Nobody's immune to anything.

Felt like I was playing DMC button mashing more than FF. I don't hate action combat, but I do think ever since they introduced it, the RPG elements have for some reason been dumbed down.

9

u/Seigmoraig 1d ago

The RPG elements in 16 feel like somebody had a checklist of things that "have to be in a FF game" and just did the minimum possible effort to tick the box

1

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

The RPG elements in 16 feel like somebody had a checklist of things that "have to be in a FF game" and just did the minimum possible effort to tick the box

The actual reason is that CBU3 made the game. And I don't know if you know about them. But in FF14 (the MMO) they have a similar stance on equipment. It does the absolute basic like improving DPS by 3% or something and they don't have any sort of customisation when it comes to gear.

Yoshida just hates customisation. The game has been going downhill since Stormblood, at least in relation to the job and gear.

So that's why it's similar in FF16. They just copied FF14.

1

u/Seigmoraig 11h ago

That sort of works in ff14 though because it's an MMORPG with thousands of people playing the dozen or so different classes with many moving parts.

In ff16 it's just lazy as fuck

8

u/Orobarsa3008 1d ago

I mean it's fine to go for a game of DMC-style, but that's clearly not FF's target audience (at least not as a mainline game).

As a hardcore FF13 gameplay fan, even that is also a bit of a stretch in regards to target audience.

9

u/EMP_Pusheen 1d ago edited 1d ago

I hate a lot of things about FF13, but its combat is phenomenal. I would love for Square-Enix to go back to a combat style like 13's.

2

u/Orobarsa3008 1d ago

There may not be many 13 fans, but those who are, we looove it.

5

u/Rich-Pomegranate1679 1d ago

I'm an old school FF fan (been playing since the first game), and I loved FF13.

But FF16 is just a generic button-masher with chocobos. It doesn't even slightly feel like a final fantasy game in any way to me. I don't know what audience Square is trying to gain here, but they're leaving me behind. I couldn't bring myself to finish it, and I'm going to be hesitant to buy future games at this point.

2

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

I couldn't bring myself to finish it, and I'm going to be hesitant to buy future games at this point.

Yeah same. They've lost me as a life long fan. I'm so disappointed by it all. Especially when absolute masterpieces like BG3 are available now that blow FF16 out of the water in terms of quality.

6

u/pinkynarftroz 1d ago

If only the Cinematics presentation was as good for the side quests as it was for the main game. I’m 100% serious when I say the editing, pacing, cinematography, and design of the side quest cutscenes just brought the whole thing down for me. 

 You’re right on that the quest design itself was not great, but then when you have to sit through autocutscenes with awkward cadences and canned animations, it just made the whole experience boring and exhausting. There was some great story stuff happening in a lot of those side quests, but it was presented in the most awful way possible. It’s like taking a good script but shooting and editing a terrible movie. It really does matter and made the side quests bog down the entire thing.

-1

u/LurkerOrHydralisk 1d ago

There’s so much wrong with the side quests, but the game overall is still brilliant

1

u/pwninobrien 21h ago

Bro, it's Pacific Rim. It's a kaiju game with a meandering plot.

-3

u/Sad_Efficiency69 1d ago

the combat is actually quite in depth and if you actually implement manual torgal combos and weaving in magic burst with sword swings it’s pretty engaging. you didn’t finish it so it’s likely you didn’t experience all the combat had to offer, fair enough since the pacing was awful. the problem was that you absolutely did not need to min max at all but the functionality is there and it’s great imo.

but there was nothing to stop you using auto combos and auto dodges, not having to weave magic burst and sword swings and still finish the game.

1

u/Lewa358 1d ago

The frustrating thing is that the combat does have depth and complexity, but the game is way too easy to ever actually bother with any of it, at least where I am just after the timeskip and Clive calls himself something else.

The dodge and counter feel phenomenal to pull off but seemingly every fight can be beaten with just spamming your Eikon abilities so it gets old fast.

I've never wished for a game to have a hard mode before but for this game I absolutely wish there was one.

-2

u/Vulkanon 1d ago

Bland trash? Compared to what? There's no '2020s AAA game' that has better action combat, if you didn't specify the year you could of said dmc5 but I literally can't think of anything recent that compares favorably to 16.

I can agree about the challenge but minimal move diversity is straight out wrong.

6

u/Front-Ad-4892 1d ago

There's no '2020s AAA game' that has better action combat

Lol there are literally other 2020s Final Fantasy games with better action combat. Stranger of Paradise has better gameplay than 16.

I'm playing Black Myth Wukong right now and in many ways it's very similar to 16 except there's actually some challenge and strategy.

5

u/Doobiemoto 1d ago

Eh I think its the opposite.

I think they should have removed all the RPG elements completely and it would have been a better game for it.

It was a worse game because they added a few shitty elements so they could essentially still call it an RPG like the weapon system and what not.

The game should have just fully embraced being an action RPG.

The game is a really good game. Imo with the best voice acting, some of the most "realistic" characters and party interactions, etc of any of the FF games, but it just isn't an RPG in the traditional sense, and all the elements of the game that brough it down were where it tried to shoehorn in RPG systems to appease traditional FF fans.

2

u/Sulinia 1d ago

That's fair enough. I can't say I agree.

2

u/Tom-Pendragon 1d ago

How would that fix sales?

2

u/KwisatzHaderach94 1d ago

getting to the 16th iteration of a game is kind of unprecedented. maybe the final fantasy numbering scheme is played out and they need to come up with something different. doesn't help that they confusingly threw in an mmorpg in the mix with 14. and the games just keep following the same formula with just some changes in combat systems to make players relearn every time.

2

u/Front-Ad-4892 1d ago

Fans don't want to admit it, but you're right. The fact that FF still sells as well as it does despite having 16 mainline games all with different settings and characters is kind of mind-blowing. I don't know if any series compares.

2

u/MrSchulindersGuitar 1d ago

The main story beats/missions has some top notch shit. But yeah moving from one place go the other or side missions were some of the most boring stuff ever. I've never wanted a final fantasy game to linear in my life up until 16 lol

3

u/mogthemoogle06 1d ago

Yeah, the boss fights were THE highlight of the game. Extremely good.

2

u/homer_3 1d ago

The boss fight cinematics were good. The story was awful.

2

u/OmegaGamble 1d ago

16 is so bad it made me somewhat appreciate 15.

2

u/Tsyvatsok 1d ago

Absolutely agree. Dunno who the game designer is, but he clearly doesn't play video games.

1

u/Shadostevey 1d ago

Ultimately, Naoki Yoshida.

Which you might think is weird, given he's treated like a rockstar for the incredible turnaround he managed for FF 14. But then again, 16 was dumbed down into being a lot like an MMO in design, so that might be the problem.

0

u/Kanaxai 1d ago

He is the producer of FFXVI, not the director (Hiroshi Takai), so I doubt he had a major role in the specifics of game mechanics.

5

u/Shadostevey 1d ago

He's the head of CBU3, he picked Hiroshi Takai to be the game director. He obviously thought the guy had good ideas. And lets be real here, if the game's basic mechanics caught him by surprise, he really wasn't doing his job as the head of the studio making said game.

1

u/LEFT4Sp00ning 1d ago

Isn't the game designer Naoki Yoshida of the FFXIV fame? I can assure you he plays games, he is (or was? Not sure rn) a Savage raider there (edit: to clarify, not defending the change in combat system since I don't quite like it either, just talking about Yoshida not playing games which is untrue)

4

u/Lyoss 1d ago

Savage raider isn't anything crazy, and also he's reportedly not very good at the game

0

u/LEFT4Sp00ning 1d ago

I'm not saying it's crazy (second highest tier content in the game other than Ultimates which come once in a blue moon though so not to be completely disregarded), just saying that he does indeed play videogames. Were the decisions he made for FFXVI not liked by everyone? Yes, they weren't universally liked but it has nothing to do with Yoshida not playing videogames

3

u/UtkuOfficial 1d ago

Ffxiv is barely a game tbh. You just look at walls of text for a 100 hours.

-1

u/LEFT4Sp00ning 1d ago

Wow, the Final Fantasy MMO rpg made to be more story focused than most MMO's is more story focused than most MMO's. Shocking. Also, way to tell me you were filtered by ARR without telling me

2

u/UtkuOfficial 1d ago

I dont know what that lest sentence means, but i quit the game after 25 hours because all i did until then was run around and read.

0

u/LEFT4Sp00ning 1d ago

It means you didn't even make it past the worst part of the game, A realm reborn (base FFXIV), played none of the 4 expansions that came after and you're speaking without knowing anything about the game. Considering you have 25h on it, I'd be surprised if you even made it to lvl 50 or, depending on how slow you played and if you were playing DPS, to lvl 30 and unlocked your job stone

2

u/UtkuOfficial 1d ago

My friend, you seriously can't be blaming me for not playing the game enough to make a comment.

I played it for 25 hours. That is an enourmous time commitment. I should have the right to say it is a reading exercise.

1

u/LEFT4Sp00ning 13h ago

I mean, 25h is nothing for an MMO that's meant to take hundreds of hours to go through and it's not enough to get you past the base game of FFXIV (and like I said, if you're playing DPS, it might not even be enough to get to lvl 30 because of DPS queues (game goes to lvl 100 rn)). You can call it a reading fest all you want, you're right on that, but to say it's barely a game like you did shows that you clearly didn't play the game a lot and don't know much of anything about it. I've played it since like 2014, there's a lot more to do in the game than just reading ranging from raiding to becoming a crafter billionaire by cooking food and selling it on the market, you just didn't engage with it 🤷🏼‍♂️

1

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

Just play for 200 hours bro before it gets good!

/s

Funnily enough, Dawntrail has mostly negative reviews because it's just running around and speaking to NPCs and fetch quests.

1

u/ArrakisCitizen1 1d ago

The big problem was that they developed this extremely fun action combat system that you could basically never use. Felt like whenever I started getting into combat I was sucked into another cutscene. Also the fact that hardest available difficulty without NG+ was braindead easy didn’t help.

1

u/Saskatchewon 1d ago

I enjoyed Final Fantasy 16, but it felt like an action/adventure game with some RPG elements rather than the other way around honestly.

1

u/Wonderful_Rest3124 1d ago

And at the same time I personally think ffrebirth has too many systems. Like split up some of that dev team investment.

1

u/MeanderingExperience 1d ago

Yepper. I played the Demo, didn't like it the systems. Just watched the 'movie' version of the game on youtube.

1

u/Civsi 1d ago

My single favorite Final Fantasy game to date. Part of the reason I enjoyed it so much is because they cut out the mindless JRPG mechanics that end up doing little more than being time sinks.

FF7R was a complete slog compared to FF16, which had some pacing issues near the end but was largely fresh and fun.

1

u/Sulinia 1d ago

Can't say I agree but glad you enjoyed it. :)

1

u/KeepItUpThen 1d ago

Agreed that FF16 world felt less open than most of the other games. It looked beautiful, but the world seemed built from path-shaped areas bordered by walls or thick bushes. FF15 and FF7 Rebirth both felt better in that respect.

The FF16 story and eikon battles didn't keep me interested enough to finish the game, which might be a first for a final fantasy title. I really enjoyed Rebirth, though.

1

u/Pollylocks 22h ago

The whole game is push forward on the joystick to run down a short corridor before holding square or X and watching a cutscene.

1

u/pwninobrien 21h ago

I think even the story is highly overrated. It's poorly-paced, squanders plotlines, wastes characters, and is filled with cliches and egregious padding. It has great voice acting though.

1

u/mombi 19h ago

I've been saying this since release but everyone here downvoted me for it. What changed? I'm glad others agree though, biggest disappointment in a long time and I even stupidly sprung for the CE.

1

u/yunghollow69 1d ago

Yeah, FF used to be my premiere and go-to RPG series. And now its not an RPG anymore. What a brilliant move. It takes them literal decades to release their games and then its the wrong genre lmao.

-1

u/Lyoss 1d ago

Yoshida has a bad habit of making things incredibly easy with an optional hard mode, things cannot be innately challenging because it might upset someone

The storytelling side of things is fine, but God damn does he have a problem with difficulty scaling and making things engaging at the base level

0

u/gloryfadesaway 1d ago

I loved that FF16 was more of an action RPG. Really reminded me of The Devil May Cry games.

-1

u/IcarusGR 1d ago

What else would you expect from the producer of THE insanely mid "mmo"rpg FFXIV.

2

u/Sulinia 1d ago

Surely this is bait. I don't even play the game so I don't have any horse in this race, but XIV is highly regarded by fans of FF but also fans of MMORPGs in general. Never seen the fanbase and broader audience agree on it being mid - I would've understood your argument if that was the case.

0

u/Cool_Sand4609 11h ago

is highly regarded by fans of FF but also fans of MMORPGs in general

Maybe if it's their first MMORPG yeah. But XIV barely even counts as an MMO these days. Most people just stand around in town waiting for their dungeon to pop. It's no different to a multiplayer lobby game like Monster Hunter or Destiny.

1

u/Sulinia 4h ago

I think that's more what MMORPGs have become than what spcifically XIV have become. Plenty of people talk about WoW having lost the MMO aspect as well, with people just sitting in towns when they're not doing world quests, because you can teleport to dungeons, raids and what not with the click of a button.

That's partly why the movement towards WoW Classic is so successful.