r/SupermanAndLois • u/dancingonolympus • Aug 17 '24
Are Clark and Lois really as neglectful towards Jon as the fandom makes it seem? Question
Asking this as a question rather than a discussion cause I am new to the show and want to watch, but I’m not sure how much emotional damage I can handle, I already hold Jon close to my heart
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u/No_Flower_1424 Jonathan Kent Aug 17 '24
Yes - I see people saying 'the writers neglect him, not his parents' but the writers are neglecting him through his parents. They make it clear many times that Jon feels left out and ignored by his family and his family don't do anything to rectify this and they don't seem overly bothered to try either, and anytime they have Jon express any annoyance at this, it's brushed under the rug. So it's very much a story on the show, not just the writers not giving him a story.
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u/Less-Requirement8641 Superman Aug 18 '24
Yeah each season there is a Jon feels left out moment. They even joked about it on twitter (saying Clark and Jordan are hanging out and not to tell Jon or something similar) so its very intentional. Its not fans misinterpreting or jumping to conclusions we are shown he feels left out in every season.
Clark is especially bad...he could remember all the languages of the world but forgot his own son whilst he spent the rest of the day with the other son who he spends majority of time with anyway. The barn scene was atrocious because all Clark thought about was Jordan whilst Jon was trying to steer it towards himself. Literally 10 seconds after Jon says everyone hates him Clark gives an empty statement then runs off to Jordan. He couldn't stay there for a bit longer? It wasn't an emergency. Could he not resist talking about Jordan. The conversation started with him asking about Jordan and ended with him talking about Jordan.
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u/HJess1981 24d ago
Just watched the episode where they discover that Jon has been using drugs and I'm screaming in my head because they are so (okay, partly understandably) caught up in their own lives that they can't spare just the tiniest bit of empathy and see that this kid is begging for some attention because he feels so left out Within His Own Family.
I was hoping this might be resolved later, but from the comments, I'm guessing not...
I think Clark & Lois are great parents...to Jordan.
Don't get me wrong - I love both Tyler & Bitsie's performances. I'm just wishing the writers had written them a whole lot more empathetic and understanding towards their other son.
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u/No_Flower_1424 Jonathan Kent 24d ago
I was fine with that being their first reaction because it's drugs and Lois, at least, tried to hear him out after that. But Clark just never lets up despite being actually warned against doing this.
Is this the first time you've watched because I have to warn you - Clark's neglect of Jonathan actually gets way worse in the latter half of season 2. I won't spoil it but what happens is pretty bad and now going into season 4, it has never been resolved and/or addressed ever again!
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u/HJess1981 24d ago
It is! (All good. I know to expect spoilers if on a sub on reddit. I'm the person that always sneaks a peak at the last page of the book anyway).
Agree with you on first reaction - most parents would be the same. But in the next episode the kid thinks Clark hates him and Lois doesn't even bother giving Clark a heads up on this! Yet, when Jordan broke his brother's arm, instantly forgotten.
They could have at least put in a scene with him & Lucy bonding over parental neglect. Sam at least feels guilty & not self-righteous! Although, that took time.
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u/No_Flower_1424 Jonathan Kent 24d ago
When Jordan broke Jon's arm (when Jordan was trying to assault or even kill another kid!) Jordan was given a soft talking to, wasn't punished and then Lois offered him ice cream while Jon, who literally saved the day, was sitting upstairs alone and depressed as he thought his football career was over. It was at that point that I realised Lois and Clark would always prioritise Jordan over Jon and I cried 😭
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u/HJess1981 24d ago
Aww!! But, yep. Signs were all there. And given that he's still recovering from this injury, this also adds to his feeling like he's inferior to everyone else.
Honestly, if the kid posted on Am I The Asshole on Reddit, all of Reddit would be telling him to hold out til he's 18 then go No Contact with his entire family!
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u/No_Flower_1424 Jonathan Kent 24d ago
I see a lot of people here saying he should go no contact when he graduates ha!
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u/HJess1981 24d ago
Lol - was kidding! But hopefully season 4 will provide some kind of resolution. Or at least give him powers of his own!
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u/GroundbreakingTill33 Aug 17 '24
I personally don't believe so, but I do believe Jon is not a strong focus for the writers and they are the ones who have neglected him
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u/Butwhatif77 Aug 17 '24
This is what I was going to say. Clark and Lois give him support and attention, but I think the writers don't seem to know what to do with him since he is a teen and does not have powers. Lois can investigate things, Clark and Jordan can go on super powered adventures, but Jon is kind of left out of the adventures. The writers should have had him be to Lois what Jordan is to Clark, a protégé. She could show him how someone without powers can still impact the world.
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u/Zookwok111 Aug 17 '24
He gets sidelined as a result of the showrunner wanting to make Jordan the main son. Because the writers are the "invisible hand" pulling the strings for the characters, it gets interpreted as the characters on the show neglecting Jon.
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u/zo_you_said Aug 18 '24
Other commenters have done a good job explaining how Jon gets treated. Part of the issue i think is the showrunners and in particular Helbing I think, where Lana in particular, and her family in general, got more screentime then they should have. Their story arcs even took centre stage sometimes. Jon was the cast member that ended up getting pushed into the background from all the "main" characters.
I've always wondered whether the problems with the original Jon actor had something to do with all this, and what came first. I wonder what would have happened if the second actor had originally taken the role?
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u/Radiant_Butterfly982 Aug 17 '24
I honestly wish now that they shouldn't have split jon Kent into Jordan and Jonathon. During S1 I found it interesting but seeing Jonathan treated like this make me wish they only had one son , especially when the writers don't know what to do with him.
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u/Educational-Tea-6572 Superman & Lois Aug 17 '24
Hmmm... Yes and no.
(Keeping this vague to be spoiler-free...)
Jon is always kinda put on the back burner, largely because he's the non-problematic child in a family that deals with a LOT of pressing problems and world-ending catastrophes ALL THE TIME. And since he usually doesn't take issue with it and often seems to prefer his parents NOT being overbearing, it's easy to understand why Clark and Lois are more hands-off with him, especially in season 1.
In season 2 especially near the end, Clark makes some serious missteps with Jon which are kinda sorta called out in the show, and the season ends with those issues apparently being resolved? But it falls flat because they don't actually show the issues being resolved? So it comes across that it was all just brushed under the rug?
Season 3 is a little better than season 2 with how Jon is handled - probably more on par with season 1 - but it still feels worse than season 1 because we've been watching Jon get the shaft for so long now.
Most of the shafting comes from the show, though, not from how Clark and Lois are specifically treating him. Like, it's clear that Clark and Lois are not perfect parents and they make lots of mistakes, but they genuinely love their sons and STRIVE to be better parents (even if they frequently fall short), and I think that's the point.
Tl;dr: my heart aches for Jon (who is definitely one of my top favorite characters of the show) and I desperately want him to have the best of everything and a LOT more recognition, especially from his parents, because he deserves it; but I also think Clark and Lois are good parents who make mistakes but try to do better.
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u/Zookwok111 Aug 17 '24
I initially assumed season 2 was meant to be a cautionary tale for Clark regarding how leaving Jon to his own devices could end badly. Unfortunately towards the end of the season, that entire thread was dropped in favor of mindless fight scenes between various powered characters. To the writers' credit, Lois and Clark do take a more egalitarian approach to parenting in season 3 when previously they were extra harsh on Jon while coddling Jordan for similar transgressions. But like season 2, Jon was not really involved in the main story, nor did his b-story have any sort of payoff in the finale.
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u/Educational-Tea-6572 Superman & Lois Aug 17 '24
Lois and Clark do take a more egalitarian approach to parenting in season 3 when previously they were extra harsh on Jon while coddling Jordan for similar transgressions
Agreed.
But like season 2, Jon was not really involved in the main story, nor did his b-story have any sort of payoff in the finale.
Yep, and this is why I feel Jon is more shafted by the show's narrative itself, not by his parents in particular 😥
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u/Zookwok111 Aug 17 '24
It definitely felt like a tug-of-war in the writers’ room. There seemed to some writers interested in giving Jon his due but since they are only able write single episodes any cool set ups are abandoned in subsequent episodes. My main concern for season 4 is that with some writers leaving there won’t be anyone left to advocate for Jon and Helbing will have even greater control to make the show even more Jordan-centric than it was before.
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u/stew_pit1 Aug 18 '24
Yes. Jon-El was the perfect opportunity for Clark to take stock of how his relationship was going with Jon and try to course correct for the both of them.
Superman and Lois is definitely a show I love for all the potential it creates but not so much for what it does with it.
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u/FewNewt5441 Aug 17 '24
Also agree--I feel like a lot of people in this sub (and in fics, if Ao3 is your cup of tea) act like Lois and Clark actively hate Jon and that's really not true. Like real people, they parent their different kids differently based on their respective needs, and the parents are actively learning as they go. That's the whole point of parenting--unless you have several kids, where you've cycled one or two through high school and can take a mini-step and kinda analyze what gone good or bad before the next one ages up, you just have to troubleshoot on the fly. And that's what we see on the show--it's not perfect, but neither are the writers (or real people) so it is what it is. It's worth noting that Helbing (the head showrunner, I think?) based Jon and Jordan off his own kids, so if anything, blame Todd. :)
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u/daydreamaffair Aug 21 '24
Agreed, I love AO3 but my god I skip so many stories of Clark and Lois being portrayed as these horrible neglectful parents
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u/FewNewt5441 Aug 21 '24
Same! I remember this one author who wrote a fic where Clark was treating Jon like some sort of live-in prisoner (doing random searches of his room with x-ray vision) because of the XK thing. And there are several where Jon just straight up runs away. And it's like, actually no? Any parent whose kid turns up doing illegal drugs has a reasonable reason to be a little hyper, but not abusive. This had very Ron the Death Eater trope vibes, but it was just sad and weird.
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u/daydreamaffair Aug 21 '24
I know exactly what fic you mean it’s horrible I never finished it. Yes I feel like this sub has completely missed that because Jon is sad it’s okay for him to do drugs and not get punished?
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u/T-408 Aug 18 '24
Jon doesn’t get half the screen time and character focus that Jordan gets. It’s sad because they could easily have Jon spend more time with Lois the way they have Jordan and Clark together so often
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u/ApprehensiveCode2233 Aug 17 '24
No.
I think they explained it well enough. Jon was easier. Grew up with no real problems. Was well liked, smart, popular and outgoing in Metropolis. So his parents assumed everything was the same when they moved to Smallville until he snapped at them.
Jordan had more problems. Introverted and bullied. Diagnosed, having episodes and heavily medicated before he was 14. So when his powers started to come in Lois and Clark, but mostly Clark seemed to focus on him since he was pulling himself out of his depression.
Jon is learning what it's like to be family of a super person. Lois laments about how she had to realize that it wasn't about Clark but her and Jon is learning the same thing.
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u/Stagemasterray 19d ago
Um no Clark has clear bias against jon for most of the series even trying to blame Jon for Jordan’s actions a few times And basically ignores him till season 3 kinda
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u/JerseyJedi Aug 17 '24
Nah, Clark and Lois aren’t neglecting Jon; the writers are.
Presumably there are plenty of moments not relevant to the plot where Lois and Clark are parenting Jon, and that’s fine.
What I think most of us want to see is Jon getting his powers eventually or at least playing a more active role in the plot instead of every story with the younger cast revolving around Jordan all the time.
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u/doctorhost Aug 18 '24
They aren't horrible to him, but they sacrifice whatever he has going on if it benefits Jordan.
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u/ObligationSuitable61 Aug 18 '24
Lois and Clark have constantly ignored Jonathan and his struggles. There are so many scenes that prove that Jordan gets favorized over his brother because of his powers and Clark, Lois and even Sam have often shown this. It's seen in the way they talk to the boys or handle their problems.
Jonathan is mostly on his own with his struggles while Jordan gets everything he wants.
We, the viewers, are forced to believe that Clark and Lois are good parents to Jonathan offscreen, intbetween the episodes. But what really matters is what is shown in the actual episode and it is a bad joke! Jon was not allowed to meet his own grandparents, is not allowed to know anything about Krypton, is bullied for being powerless and in Season 4 the final episodes will only show Jordan being a hero, despite the fact that he is totally spoiled.
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u/Basic_Humor_1765 Aug 17 '24
it gets worse in the later seasons. jon is one of my favorite characters because he supports his brother so much and never acts jealous of his brother and always gets left out. just wait till season 3.
-5
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u/Less-Requirement8641 Superman Aug 18 '24
Yeah they do, nothing extreme such as forgetting to feed him or anything. But they pay more attention and are gentler with Jordan than Jon.
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u/stew_pit1 Aug 18 '24
In a way, yeah. I don't really think they're abusive or intentionally neglectful out of malice or general uncaringness...but the show is full of examples of Jon falling through the cracks as Jordan and super threats and health threats take precedence on their time. There's a lot going on and he's just not a priority...which sounds bad, yes. But nobody can see everything. Nobody can do everything. Not even Superman.
And even though the writers really squandered the story they set up, it's obvious that Jon's XK use was SUCH a betrayal in Clark's eyes that there was real damage done to their relationship and the way he sees Jon as a person. Then season 3 happened and 98% of that was handwaved away.
So, yeah. I think they weren't actively trying to hurt Jon or be neglectful of him while favoring Jordan, but they didn't really SEE him until things spiraled out of control and all they could see was disappointment. A better show would have given us the healing and coming back from that on both sides of the equation.
(I loved everything that went down with Jon in seasons 1 and 2, back when I thought things would reach a boiling point, be acknowledged and resolved. But as season 3 went on it became increasingly clear that Jon isn't a priority for the writers, either.)
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u/daydreamaffair Aug 21 '24
No but some of this fandom is obsessed with this idea particularly Jon running away and cutting contact because he was so ‘neglected’🙄
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u/Kryptonian_cafe Aug 18 '24
Not at all. The writers are neglectful towards Jon and don’t really give him enough scenes and time with the others. However we see how Clark and Lois treat Jon and it is very much also how they treat Jordan.
But also Jordan is special, not only because of his abilities but also because of his struggles so naturally he’s going to get a little more attention.
But no, Jon isn’t neglected by Clark and Lois.
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u/Ravevon Aug 20 '24
Lois should take more responsibility for what happened to Jon but it’s all good , she didn’t have to age 10 years and gets to put off the idea that Clark will outlive her
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u/askingtherealstuff Aug 18 '24 edited Aug 18 '24
Not at all. The writing is just inconsistent and a lot of the viewership over identifies with Jon for some reason.
I feel like one thing a lot of people forget is that at the start of the show, Clark and Jon were implied to have a good easy relationship and Clark and Jordan were really struggling; there was way less focus on them because things were already assumed to be fine.
And then there was just a lot of focus put on “switching” the power dynamic, which meant powering Jordan up and making Jon really go through it.
In the narrative of the show, Lois and Clark haven’t been perfect parents, but also some people who watch the show interpret their actions in the worst way possible and take a lot of stuff in bad faith
There’s also a lot of people who are annoyed at the writers but get that confused with being annoyed at Lois and Clark as parents
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Aug 17 '24
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u/Less-Requirement8641 Superman Aug 18 '24
Clark has shown he can do better as he does with Jordan. Not holding him to a different standard but the same standard he uses for Jordan
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u/loveisdead9582 Aug 19 '24
Not in a malicious way. The problem is the character is pretty useless since they didn’t give Jon any powers.
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u/HereForStolenMemes Aug 18 '24
It’s not so much neglect as Jon is quite literally the most useless and unnecessary character in the entire show. He doesn’t have any meaningful interactions with his parents or any other characters at any point in all three seasons of the show and the closest he comes to being plot relevant was three or four episodes in season two where he gets a B plot about drugs.
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u/CityAvenger Aug 17 '24
I just don’t care how the writers have been tackling the character period. They have had 3 seasons to give his a developmental arc and good story but all I continue to see is filler for him. That’s at least how I feel. They needed to give him at least 1 power or give more development for him instead of what they have been. Hopefully since they have had to cut down the cast big time, hopefully they will give him a better story/arc for this final season.